[Assam] [asom] Assamese Fears and Saviours

[Chan Mahanta]

>Didnt the same dysfunctional system give you your IIT degree (and to 
>many of us here) that >enabled you to get your passport to the west?


*** Even the desi-sorkar-defenders will tell us, that the rigorous 
IIT training, inculcating the fundamentals, do what they do, IN SPITE 
of dysfunctional desi govt. They have had a degree of autonomy and 
freedom from governmental meddling; not to mention the luxury of 
picking the most trainable students and the resources to attract the 
most qualified faculties with a more attractive remunerative package 
and better infrastructure.

When the CENTER reserves the right to expend the resources in the 
manner they do at IITs and IIMS , it does NOT, in any way shape or 
form, prove that the Center is a BETTER manager or that the system is 
truly FUNCTIONAL, only that Assam or Bihar don't know how to use it.

I emphasized 'fundamentals' above with a reason: To point to the 
absence of CREATIVE thinking and problem solving training in these 
IITs ( can't speak about IIMs). One can do great math, recite chapter 
and verse on scientific theories, but get blunted by a simple design 
problem requiring creative thinking.

Furthermore, IIT and IIM grads. do not a nation build. The nation 
builders are not these high exam scoring god's-gift-to-humnanity 
types: The nation builders are the humble brick-layers, farmers, 
plumbers, carpenters, mechanics,primary healthcare deliverers, 
effective primary school teachers who teach the nation its 
FUNDAMENTALS.

One might have thought that would have registered on those who sing 
the praises of MBA-dom.

And finally, my ticket to leave was NOT from my IIT-degree. Nobody 
even knew what that was in my days. And what I learnt, was, again, IN 
SPITE of the environment. The difference was ACCESS, EXPOSURE ! And 
that attitude, a result of my upbringing, and for which I make no 
apologies.


>__do-able and constructive suggestion from you?

*** If what I point out is WRONG, defective, unacceptable; then why 
should *I* be asked for solutions ? Are we trying to have it both 
ways? What happened to those who DEFEND the dysfunctional? One would 
thing that those are the ones who ought to teach the ignorant how to 
get it done.


>--- EVERYTHING is wrong about India

*** That is a very old and tired argument, that so many desis that 
get heart-burn from my analyses, make. By accusing me of finding 
EVERYTHING wrong, they attempt to make me look unreasonable and 
extreme; hoping that would somehow take the sting away from what I 
point out. Unfortunately it does not work that way, particularly with 
people who are willing to apply their reasoning abilities.

The trick to avoid heart-burn, is NOT to DENY the truths or AVOID 
acknowledging them; which opens the way to a productive dialogue.


>And who will lead the charge - is it going to be you??

*** Those who know where the problems lie. Just because I am not 
there to lead the charge does not mean, that what I point out ' is 
useless, so why make those of us insecure of our national origin 
identity squirm in front of the world'?
I contribute MY FAIR SHARE by laying bare the issues, pointing to 
what is wrong.; unlike those who would DENY them. Fortunately there 
are many who have not closed their minds.


>What we need is a great visionary who can work within the existing 
>system and who can >implement accountability.


*** Great visionaries are always nice to have. I have heard that 
umpteen times spreading a decade and more. I even suggested that an 
Indian Institute of Visionaries ( or Great Leaders) be opened to 
churn them out. I also  proposed that perhaps India can IMPORT them 
from where they are more plentiful.

But just my luck: No one listens !

In the mean time, pending IIV/IIGL or GL import liberalization, we 
need EFFECTIVE institutions of state with which, 'the remaining few 
GOOD folks'( I hope it is not an oxymoron yet) can turn things 
around: To better manage their affairs of state, to PUNISH bad 
behavior and REWARD the good.

That is the bottom line.


>My intention is not to take up valuable server space in assam.org by 
>filling up endless >pages arguing with you.

*** That is a noble intent. And I would be the first to acknowledge 
that I have been a corrosive influence to impressionable minds in 
this forum. But old habits die hard. My bad.


>  >Your pompous and quarellsome attitude makes it difficult to carry 
>on a conversation towards any reasonable end.


*** Again a bitter truth. Pomposity is my middle name, quarrelsomeness is my
credo. But it was NOT I who opened this thread with the 
not-so-pompous "That is the hallmark of an ignorant society. While 
the ones capable of making a difference only want to reap undue 
benefits from high office, an equally ignorant populace either goes 
about just accepting things or just blaming the "centre" - for the 
centre is a convenient scapegoat.", even though I do agree with the 
IGNORANCE of the intelligentsia
who cannot figure out why things are how they are.


>I am not surprised by your contention that a Bharat darshan will 
>only worsen your >perception. The reason is that a one-track mind 
>with one-eyed vision cannot be expected to >take in the good and the 
>bad with equal elan. Your preconceived notions will look 
>for >specific oppurtunities to further your biased logic. If ever 
>you do go for such a darshan, I >would suggest that you start from 
>Assam and then go outwards. And please do carry some >freinds along 
>(if you got any) so that we can have some advantage of a difference 
>of >opinion.


*** Thanks for the advice and the philosophical analyses. I will keep 
them in mind. You are also right about my paucity of friends with the 
right attitudes. But I make do with those who are struggling with 
less-than-the-right ones. After all, birds-of-a-feather----- you know?


cm












At 4:39 PM -0800 12/2/06, SANDIP DUTTA wrote:
>Dear Sir,
>
>
>
>Unmitigated Gall - Indeed!
>
>
>
>Didnt the same dysfunctional system give you your IIT degree (and to 
>many of us here) that enabled you to get your passport to the west?
>
>
>
>In the course of our conversations have we come accross even one 
>do-able and constructive suggestion from you? Apart from blaming the 
>"colonial" centre and your oft repeated stories about how EVERYTHING 
>is wrong about India, you have little or no ideas. Vague suggestions 
>of "reforms", "change this or that etc" is like advising a cancer 
>patient over telephone from overseas to go and see a good doctor. 
>Its all fine if you are not involved in person, isnt it?
>
>
>
>And who will lead the charge - is it going to be you?? You seemed to 
>have debunked most others who actually have done lots that can be 
>counted materially- for eg. Dr. Hazarika of the Assam Inst. of Mgmt.
>
>
>
>What we need is a great visionary who can work within the existing 
>system and who can implement accountability. Such a person with a 
>team thats willing to listen to him can change things in Assam.
>
>
>
>My intention is not to take up valuable server space in assam.org by 
>filling up endless pages arguing with you. Your pompous and 
>quarellsome attitude makes it difficult to carry on a conversation 
>towards any reasonable end.
>
>
>
>I am not surprised by your contention that a Bharat darshan will 
>only worsen your perception. The reason is that a one-track mind 
>with one-eyed vision cannot be expected to take in the good and the 
>bad with equal elan. Your preconceived notions will look for 
>specific oppurtunities to further your biased logic. If ever you do 
>go for such a darshan, I would suggest that you start from Assam and 
>then go outwards. And please do carry some freinds along (if you got 
>any) so that we can have some advantage of a difference of opinion.
>
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>SD
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----
>From: Chan Mahanta <cmahanta at charter.net>
>To: SANDIP DUTTA <pseude at yahoo.com>; assam at assamnet.org
>Cc: assamrs at gmail.com
>Sent: Friday, December 1, 2006 3:06:17 AM
>Subject: Re: [Assam] [asom] Assamese Fears and Saviours
>
>Dear Sandip Dutta:
>
>  >That is the hallmark of an ignorant society. While the ones 
>capable of making a >difference only want to reap undue benefits 
>from high office, an equally >ignorant populace either goes about 
>just accepting things or just >blaming the "centre" - for the centre 
>is a convenient scapegoat.
>
>
>** Was this not where we started?
>
>If so, how do you propose to empower the IGNORANT POPULACE to fight 
>back, demand accountability and get it?
>
>** And would people blame the Center, if it did NOT CONTROL the 
>resources, held the controls over the purse strings, set down the 
>laws and devised the law-enforcement and adjudication mechanisms 
>that do not work?
>
>Who would YOU hold responsible under the circumstances and why?
>
>Obviously you hold the ignorant Assam populace responsible, except 
>you could not be bothered by the fact that the Indian system of laws 
>and its enforcement
>apparatus , that people in a democratic system use to control and 
>fight CORRUPTION are dysfunctional, and would not raise your voice 
>for REFORMS, while
>criticizing those who do as "-- have nothing alternative to say".
>
>You give a free pass to a colonialist Center, who steals from the 
>many of Assam and enriches a few by re-distributing it without 
>exercising its controls over how it gets disbursed or giving the 
>ignorant populace the tools of a functioning democratic state to 
>exercise their controls.
>
>And we are to think you are a part of that vaunted 
>desi-knowledge-brigade and not a part of the IGNORANT POPULACE?
>
>That is delusion, if not unmitigated gall, is how I see it.
>
>
>  >Corruption is endemic in the whole of south asia. It happens in 
>Pakistan too on >an even much greater scale
>
>*** Why not go a step further and include the whole world? After all 
>it is a human trait, isn't it? And that is exactly why more 
>intelligent people devised
>ways to control it, by PUNISHING bad behavior and REWARDING good, 
>something even the ranks of the ignorant populace understand-- as in 
>raising children, but which seems to be beyond the grasp of 
>apologists of desi-demokrasy.
>
>Oh we know why! Because they know that India is incapable of change, 
>of reforms.
>So they settle for 'doing better' while remaining mired in  desi-governance.
>To acknowledge it would pull the rug from under the feet of their 
>argument that Assam's disaffections are imaginary, or that they are 
>their own damn fault.
>
>
>But the people of Assam has no business accepting such half-a**ed 
>propositions.
>
>
>  >The reason is that many things actually work in those states. In 
>Assam they >dont.
>
>*** So how do you propose to CHANGE this? Puja? Prayers? Bribery of 
>the gods? Internet Gaali? Or wishful thinking? What?
>
>
>  >Institutions have been built in the same way in both places - but 
>how is it >they work in a few and dont in others?
>
>*** If they do, why Pres. APJAK's calls for eradicating corruption, 
>why the call for a commission to set up a HongKong style corruption 
>fighting mechanism, why the call for STRICT enforcement of laws?
>
>The big question he did not address was HOW he would accomplish all that ?
>
>
>  >Rather than just sit there and quote from pessimistic newspaper 
>articles, a >bharat-darshan is long overdue for you.
>
>*** I quote them to keep those who are either ignorant or are unwilling to see
>the real truths about India, in line.
>
>Yes, I would like to have a Bharat Darshan. But I don't think it 
>will improve my perceptions of India, only worsen it. And I know 
>Assam quite well, perhaps a whole lot more than most in this forum.
>
>
>cm
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>At 2:20 AM -0800 11/30/06, SANDIP DUTTA wrote:
>
>>Dear Sir:
>>
>>
>>
>>*******But since subtlety often goes unheeded, allow me to give 
>>some more clues and see if that helps
>>
>>
>>
>>I got all your hints but your problem is that you keep hammering in 
>>the same old point and you have nothing alternative to say. You 
>>want to change the whole system? You could give us a few hints on 
>>what ideas you have and how you plan to go about it? Maybe we can 
>>then reflect on your noble thoughts?
>>
>>
>>
>>My intention was never to sully Oxomiya society. Corruption is 
>>endemic in the whole of south asia. It happens in Pakistan too on 
>>an even much greater scale and they dont follow any version of our 
>>desi demokrasy - at least for now. But the question is why in spite 
>>of this problem, some states do better than others? In case you 
>>dont understand what I mean, ask yourself why so many Assamese have 
>>successful lives in Mumbai or Bangalore and would NOT consider 
>>returning and its not the other way round?
>>
>>
>>
>>The reason is that many things actually work in those states. In 
>>Assam they dont.
>>
>>
>>
>>If you want to understand the difference in the scale of 
>>corruption, you might want to compare how a Ticket collector 
>>behaves on a train in Kerala or Tamil Nadu compared to one in Assam.
>>
>>
>>
>>Institutions have been built in the same way in both places - but 
>>how is it they work in a few and dont in others? Only the local 
>>controllers are to blame and no one else.
>>
>>
>>
>>Rather than just sit there and quote from pessimistic newspaper 
>>articles, a bharat-darshan is long overdue for you. You will 
>>actually get to see differences in the way supposedly the SAME 
>>things work.
>>
>>
>>
>>Rgds,
>>
>>SD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message ----
>>From: Chan Mahanta <cmahanta at charter.net>
>>To: SANDIP DUTTA <pseude at yahoo.com>; assam at assamnet.org
>>Cc: Chan Mahanta <cmahanta at charter.net>; assamrs at gmail.com
>>Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 2:13:39 AM
>>Subject: Re: [Assam] [asom] Assamese Fears and Saviours
>>
>>Hi:
>>
>>
>>I did not follow up, hoping you will be able to connect the dots with the
>>
>>not-so-subtle hints that I posted.
>>
>>
>>But since subtlety often goes unheeded, allow me to give some more 
>>clues and see if that helps. I will refrain from connecting the 
>>dots myself, because spoon-feeding usually is rejected by those who 
>>are sure they know the answers and are thus not to be patronized by 
>>others:
>>
>>
>>
>>         *** WHY is it that all these representatives and their LEADERS,
>>
>>         that the people of Assam elect, throw them out, elect them again,
>>
>>         or elect a whole new slate or party in the fine traditions of
>>
>>         desi-demokrasy; remain UNRESPONSIVE and as our philosophically
>>
>>         endowed explain as "jeyei lankaloi jai, xeyei raabon hoy"
>>
>>         ( whoever goes to Lanka, becomes a Ravan)?
>>
>>
>>         There is a serious problem here isn't it?
>>
>>
>>         *** Let us take the often bled-over subject of CORRUPTION that you
>>
>>         raised, to smear the entire Oxomiya society as an uniquely sullied
>>
>>         one and as Ram seconded.
>>
>>
>>         Is corruption hard to notice? If not how come NOTHING happens
>>
>>         about it? Apparently Indian govt. system has ALL the institutional
>>
>>         mechanisms that FUNCTIONING societies USE to investigate,prosecute
>>
>>         adjudicate and punish the guilty with, at least on paper.
>>
>>
>>         And some of our learned friends also tell us that Indian judiciary is
>>
>>         among the world's best.
>>
>>
>>         So, how come NO ONE gets convicted and get punished? What seems
>>
>>         to be the matter?
>>
>>
>>         Punishment of the guilty is more than mere thirst for blood,
>>
>>         yen for retribution. It is a deterrence. And in civilized
>>
>>         societies it is also creates a social  stigma -- a very effective
>>
>>          deterrence, because it smears friends, relatives, families as well.
>>
>>
>>         Deterrence comes in many forms.The most reliable and 
>>lasting deterrence
>>
>>         is moral and ethical compunctions. We know that in western societies
>>
>>         traditionally FAITH and RELIGION helped inculcate and EDUCATION
>>
>>         that promotes critical inquiry helped spread and firmly embed it
>>
>>         with an intellectual foundation.
>>
>>
>>         But moral and ethical compunctions are NEVER enough. I have
>>
>>         argued many times in this forum, not very effectively obviously,
>>
>>         that the state cannot depend entirely on the MORAL code: It
>>
>>         also needs civil and criminal codes, that are ENFORCEABLE. 
>>That is why
>>
>>         pronouncements like ABV's -- That 'people should NOT be so greedy',
>>
>>         or APJAK's -- that ' that Manjunath was a righteous man who came
>>
>>         from a righteous family and  we must strive to make
>>
>>         more righteous families.'or MMS' that 'your CMs can make all the
>>
>>         laws in the world, but what will you do with them'  are so
>>
>>         abysmally clueless as corruption fighting steps.
>>
>>
>>         *** You gave us a fairly reasonable account of how the monies spent
>>
>>         in Assam for building roads do not produce the results expected. I
>>
>>         posted Tavleen Singh's columns to demonstrate that Assam is 
>>not unique
>>
>>         in this predicament, that it is 'pervasive across the length and
>>
>>         breadth of India'.
>>
>>
>>
>>         It was NOT, as some of you simple-mindedly assume, to absolve
>>
>>         Assam govt. of its sins. Some in the past even made the 
>>scatologically
>>
>>         smearing  Oxomiya observation " moi  gu-khaale toi-w khabi neki ?"
>>
>>
>>         So WHY do I cite them?
>>
>>
>>         For a very important reason: To show that nowhere in India
>>
>>         the CORRUPT are/could be held accountable.
>>
>>
>>         *** Now I want YOU to figure that out. Give it a little thought.
>>
>>         I like to think you are more than able to. But I also 
>>realize that you
>>
>>          and others like you, never having seen any different, and 
>>never paying
>>
>>          attention elsewhere in the world where they might have lived, failed
>>
>>         to NOTICE why or how.
>>
>>
>>         But again I will give you some clues: Read my note to Dilip Deka and
>>
>>         ex-Chief Secy. JP Rajkhowa on Nov. 18. If you don't have access to
>>
>>         it, let me know, I will be pleased to re-send.
>>
>>
>>         *** I like to think you are sincere in your efforts to understand
>>
>>         the issues. Therefore I hope to receive a response. We don't know
>>
>>         many things. It is NOT a sin not to know things. I always argue
>>
>>         that I don't OWE it to anyone to know ANYTHING, much less EVERYTHING.
>>
>>
>>         But if you go silent, like so many others often do, it will mean
>>
>>         only one thing: That you are NOT sincere about your motives. That
>>
>>         ALL you are interested in is asserting Assamese disaffections are
>>
>>         Oxomiya society's own damn fault, 'So don't bother me with facts!'
>>
>>         -- like you did when you began this thread.
>>
>>
>>         cm
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     
>>
>>     
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>At 3:49 AM -0800 11/29/06, SANDIP DUTTA wrote:
>>
>>>Dear Sir,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Whats new in this article?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>This is the same point I was trying to make but you said I was 
>>>ignorant (perhaps you didnt get it :-) ). WE too have local Sharad 
>>>Pawars and Thakreys right here in Assam and they do the same 
>>>things with central allocated money. Guwahati's moonscaped "roads" 
>>>tell the same story of corruption and deprivation originating 
>>>right here at home.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Rgds,
>>>
>>>Sandip
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----
>>>From: Chan Mahanta <cmahanta at charter.net>
>>>To: assam at assamnet.org; assamrs at gmail.com; SANDIP DUTTA <pseude at yahoo.com>
>>>Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 2:17:10 AM
>>>Subject: Re: [Assam] [asom] Assamese Fears and Saviours
>>>
>>>I am re-posting the following for Ram and Sandip Dutta to read, 
>>>before I return back to the discussions.
>>>
>>>
>>>cm
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Horrible  Condition of our Roads
>>>On the Spot
>>>   Tavleen Singh
>>>
>>>The first convoy of  official cars I encountered, driving to Pune
>>>last week, flew saffron flags on every car of the size you normally
>>>see atop temples. My driver  spotted Bal Thakeray in one of the white
>>>ambassadors. No sooner did we  pass Mcdonald's in Panvel (a
>>>travellers' watering hole) than I  spotted another official convoy.
>>>This time no saffron flags, only a car  filled with policemen in
>>>front of a grey Land Cruiser behind which was another car also filled
>>>with policemen and officials. Alone in the back  of the Land Cruiser
>>>sat Sharad Pawar.
>>>
>>>The coincidence of  encountering Maharashtra's two most powerful
>>>political leaders on the same journey made me reflect upon the role
>>>of politics in preventing  India from building the infrastructure it
>>>so badly needs. Pawar and  Thakeray would have driven down the same
>>>road I had taken from Mumbai so  they could not have failed to notice
>>>its condition. It is no longer a  road so much as a dirt track on
>>>which you bump your way from ditch to ditch to ditch. This is after
>>>you have driven bumper to bumper past  Chembur's hideous slums where
>>>
>>>public toilets are so clogged that  people prefer to squat along the
>>>main road beside the rotting garbage in  which pigs, dogs and
>>>barefoot children scrabble for food. Did Mr Pawar  notice? Did Mr
>>>Thakeray who has built a political career out of inciting  Marathi
>>>pride?
>>>
>>>Mumbai is Maharashtra's  proudest possession. Any talk of it being
>>>taken out of the State Government's control causes hackles to rise
>>>across political divisions  and yet none of this State's mighty
>>>leaders appears to have paid any  attention to the most basic
>>>requirements of social infrastructure: clean  water, sanitation and
>>>housing. Had they paid attention, then instead of  slums in Chembur
>>>there would have been affordable housing for the poor.
>>>
>>>Instead of evil slum  lords there would have been legitimate real
>>>estate companies controlling  the housing market.
>>>
>>>As for the dreadful  condition of Indian roads, please allow nobody
>>>to fool you into believing that our roads are bad because of a
>>>shortage of funds. They  are bad mainly because they have been built
>>>to last no longer than a  single season of rain. Why? Perhaps because
>>>the contractors who build  them are well connected enough to be given
>>>the same contract every year.  You notice this more on the drive from
>>>Mumbai to Pune than on any other  road because when you get onto the
>>>expressway you realize that India can  build roads that do not
>>>
>>>collapse with the rain.
>>>
>>>Once you get onto the  expressway you drive along the best road in
>>>India that has remained  totally intact despite this year's
>>>unprecedented rainfall. When I  asked a friend in the construction
>>>business why this was so he said,  "Simple. The Mumbai-Pune
>>>expressway was built by responsible  construction companies with
>>>
>>>reputations to protect. Usually roads are  built either by faceless
>>>
>>>CPWD engineers or by small contractors with big  connections."
>>>
>>>So one of the flaws in  the system is that political leaders hand out
>>>major road contracts to builders who would not pre-qualify to build a
>>>public toilet in a more  sensible country. The reason for this is
>>>that the system we devised for  these things places total emphasis on
>>>cost and none on quality. He who  makes the lowest bid wins the
>>>contract, so to cover his costs he cuts  corners and uses cheap
>>>materials and outdated technology.
>>>
>>>He could not care less  if the road he builds does not survive a
>>>single monsoon because he has,  more often than not, a connection
>>>high up enough for him to get the  contract to rebuild the road again
>>>
>>>and again. This is true across the  length and breadth of our dear
>>>Bharat Mata which is why we are  internationally renowned for having
>>>
>>>the worst roads in the world.
>>>
>>>I got off the  expressway at Chinchwad which is one of Maharashtra's
>>>leading  industrial towns. Many of India's biggest manufacturing
>>>companies have  factories here and the municipality is believed to be
>>>one of our richest  but the road I drove down was so narrow and
>>>gutted that I was stuck in  an hour long traffic jam consisting
>>>mainly of massive articulated  lorries with names like MAERSK painted
>>>on their sides. The eternal clash between the new 'emerging' economy
>>>and our ancient, socialist  infrastructure.
>>>
>>>The clash would not exist if only we  could get our political leaders
>>>to understand that unless they put  infrastructure (both social and
>>>physical) at the top of their list of  priorities we will still be
>>>talking about our 'potential' to be an  economic superpower fifty
>>>years from now. If we can just build the roads  and do something
>>>about the appalling state of our cities and towns we  can start
>>>making our economic superpower dream a reality in the next  five
>>>
>>>years. These were the gloomy thoughts of your humble columnist as I
>>>drove past a sign that warned motorists to be careful on the upcoming
>>>
>>>bridge because its condition was 'dangerous.' If we were really on
>>>our way to superpowerdom then instead of the sign we would have seen
>>>a  repaired bridge. I could go on and on and on.
>>>
>>>Recommend this page
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>assam mailing list
>>>assam at assamnet.org
>>>
>>>http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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