[Assam] Hereditary Caste System in India

Thu Mar 23 20:50:24 PST 2006

Dear Dilip,
I agree with you. However, while carrying on with our daily life, we cannot deny our "responsibility" (an unpopular word) in creating a mind-set in the country so as to eliminate the causes of suffering of innocent people. That's why I said "Inter-caste marriage, based on love and commitment between the couples, will eliminate the twin-headed monster of hereditary caste system and dowry system in India." 

By the way, Manusmriti is a "smriti", supreceded by "shruti" like Rigveda and Upanishads. Moreover, the rules prescribed in Manu are revised in different ages --- this is called Manwantara (a different Manu) --- Hinduism is NOT a rigid "religion" --- it is open to reform. 

All that we have to do is to work hard for the well-being of others --- which is "lokasangraha" in Bhagavadgita (3-20, 3-25) --- so that the world will become a beautiful place to live!

With love to everybody,
Himendra

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Dilip/Dil Deka 
  To: Himendra Thakur ; Barua25 ; Ram Sarangapani ; umesh.sh05 at post.harvard.edu 
  Cc: hthakur at comcast.net ; assam at assamnet.org 
  Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 11:15 PM
  Subject: Re: [Assam] Hereditary Caste System in India

  What difference does it make what RigVeda, Geeta or ManuSamhiti said? That's all history.
  Today's India does not know what these scriptures said. So forget it and move on. Take it as history and your heritage, and carry on with your daily life.
  Dilip

  Himendra Thakur <hthakur at comcast.net> wrote:
    Dear Rajen, Ram and Umesh,

    As regards hereditary caste system, please consider the frollowing few points: 

    Out of many verses of Rikveda, the famous twelfth verse of the Purusha Sukta of Rikveda sounds non-typical:  
    brahmana asya mukham asit bahu rajanyakah kritah
    ubdha tat asya yad vaishyah padbhyam sudrah ajayata

    "brahmin became his mouth, kshatriya (became his) arms, vaishya (became his) thighs, sudra was born from the feet"  . 

    The distinctive use of the words "became" (asit) and "born" (ajayata) indicates that this verse is not typical of most of the allegorical descriptions in Rik Veda verses. Some scholars [I am still seeking the reference] opine that this verse was added to Rik Veda at a later time by interested parties. On the other hand, the creation of the castes is described in a different way in Shatapatha Brahmana (2/10/11) or Taittiriya Brahmana (3/12/9/2) where the sudra caste is not mentioned at all. 

    More accurately, at another place in Rik Veda (9/112), we hear the rishi : 
    " . job of all persons cannot be  the same. A carpenter straightens wood, a physician looks after a patient, and a singer seeks the priest. Look at me !  I am a hymn-writer, my son is a physician, and my daughter is a cook ."

    Bhagavadgita is absolutely clear (4/13) that the four castes were created according to guna and karma (aptitude and job) . definitely not according to birth. The verses 41-44 in chapter 18 are description of the different natural aptitudes of different people, not a justification of the hereditary caste system.  

    A Brahmin, the so called highest caste of Hindus, is defined as a person with a heart as pure as a newborn baby. This proves that all newborn babies are Brahmin. This is supported by the verse in Mahabharata (Shanti Parva Chapter 188):
    na visheshah asti varnanam sarvam bhahmam idam jagat
    brahmana purvasristam hi karmabhih varnatam gatam 

    "There is nothing so special about the hereditary castes. At the beginning, everyone is a Brahmin.  Castes come up later according to job."

    One thousand years before Mahabharata and Bhagavadgita, Chandogya Upanishad carried the wonderful story of Satyakama where an illegitimate son of a slave woman was accepted as a brahmin. Later Satyakama became the principal hymn writer in Chandogya Upanishad. His disciple, Upakoshal, saw the famous truth "Sky is Love" yadeva kham tadeva kam iti. 

    GROUND REALITY OF HEREDITARY CASTE SYSTEM TODAY:  
    In spite of all scriptural clarification, Hindus in India cannot get rid of the immovable yoke of hereditary caste system. It is very important to study the cause.

    The causes of hereditary caste system appear to be the same as those of racialism all over the world. 

    In modern India, democracy is ruined by caste-oriented vote-banks practiced by the political parties. Unimaginable violence and cruelty are committed in the name of caste. Dowry system, that causes bride-burning in many cases, flourishes in the system of arranged marriage, which is a direct consequence of hereditary caste system. 

    I think Inter-caste marriage, based on love and commitment between the couples, will eliminate the twin-headed monster of hereditary caste system and dowry system in India.

    With the best wishes,
    Himendra

      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: umesh sharma 
      To: Rajen Barua ; Ram Sarangapani 
      Cc: assam at assamnet.org 
      Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 11:06 AM
      Subject: Re: [Assam] HPI, March 20, 2006

      Rajen-da,

      Even this verse by itself doesnot say that Brahmin is by birth - it merely states that Brahmins are intellectuals (from head or brain) - thus does show that intellect is superior to other things - if you believe that one part of human body is more important than others. Kshatriya is said to come from arms - denoting strength -used for fighting -does not say about hereditary caste system. 

      On the other hand it speaks of cohesion - in the sense that all people in any soicety are doing equally important work - just as parts of a human body - regardless of their social status. I repeat - no mention of hereditary caste system.

      Umesh

      Rajen Barua <barua25 at hotmail.com> wrote:
        I think it is the Gita.
        I will check
        Rajenda
          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: umesh sharma 
          To: Rajen Barua ; Ram Sarangapani 
          Cc: assam at assamnet.org 
          Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 9:37 AM
          Subject: Re: [Assam] HPI, March 20, 2006

          I do recall that there is such a verse but I do not recall seeing it in Geeta or that Krishna said it.

          Umesh

          Rajen Barua <barua25 at hotmail.com> wrote:
            I will have to read the verse in detail. I think Krishna states bothways:

            Those who are born out of my head are the Brahmins
            Those who are born out of my shoulder, are the Kshatriyas.
            Those who are born out of my stomach are the Vaishya.
            Those who are born out of my feet are the Sudras.

            Can you check if above is true.

            Rajenda
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