[Assam] HPI, March 20, 2006 -ISKCON's Gita interpretation & white skinned Brahmins

Tue Mar 28 20:19:19 PST 2006

umesh sharma <jaipurschool at yahoo.com> wrote:    Rajen-da,

  I think you do not know the history of Buddhism either except what it existed in India and Tibet perhaps. I saw lots of artifacts and statues etc of Chinese and Japanese Buddhists -- shwoing what a pantheistic religion it has turned out to be.

  I would say that every faith or ideology (lets include communism also and atheists etc) has its great days and then like the economic cycle goes thru booms and recessions. I think Hinduism is on the refirm path these days - since the teime of Dayanad Saraswati in the North and Sankardev in North East.

   I was surprised to learn that 1893 was a crucial year not only for Swami Vivekanand (on Sep 11 he gave the famous Chicago address ) but also for Mahatma Gandhi --he was thrown out of first class in South Africa since he was not white -- that was his first week there in SA. 

  In conclusion I would say that God has not made man a perfect being so none of Man's creations (religions, ideologies etc) can be perfect. But those who seek truth shopuld always try for it -- and from among the mud around seek to find the pearls.

  Umesh

Rajen Barua <barua25 at hotmail.com> wrote:
      Umesh:
  There was  never anything new to add to any religion at any time.
  When Christianity came, Judaism had everything needed for a religion. 
  When Islam came, Christianity had everything.
  Hinduism had everything that it needed when Buddhism came. 
  Religion is a question of attitude after all.
  Buddha did not discover anything new nor he said anything new.
  According to him he simply found a old abandoned path which he took.

  In one way Hinduism is like the Republicans. When you think you got them, they will very smartly come up with an example which will show that they are actually doing more for the blacks and the poor than the Democrats.
  The difference however between the R & D is again in the attitude.
  Hindusim and Buddhism is also like that.
  Buddhism simply took the position to insist that all men have equal potential for achieving the highest goal in life which is Buddhahood.
  Hindusim took the practical position that all the fingers are not equal, and here is why.....
  Yes you can show all those examples.
  And if you go deeper you will also find why a lower caste guy Valmiki had to write the Ramayana or the bastard Vyas had to compile the Vedas. It is  because in their past lives they were such and such....   and finally you loose track of the moral of the story completly except remembering that  it is 'karma' and duty which control everything.
  It is all in the attitude.
  Please note that I am not trying undermine Hinduism. I am just trying to say what it is without adding or creating anything new.
  All the fingers are not equal.
  RB 
    ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: umesh sharma 
  To: Rajen Barua ; Ram Sarangapani 
  Cc: assam at assamnet.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2006 11:51 AM
  Subject: Re: [Assam] HPI, March 20, 2006 -ISKCON's Gita interpretation & white skinned Brahmins

  Rajen-da,

  We were discussing about Gita and I think I made my point. Now you talk about Bheeshma quote (without references - I think you picked it up from C-da'd old '02 mail  mentioned today) then I can give the example of Vishwamitra who became a Brahmin despite being born in Kshatrya caste (if you go by the ongoing logic that caste is by birth) -- 

  for that matter Mahabharat was not an ideal state as far as Hindu ages go -- it was a corrupted one in which God had to take human form to do away with the evil --and lots of Brahmins and Kshatrya's got killed by God's grace -to root out evil -in Mahabharat war.

  How about so-called lower caste Valmiki writing holy Ramayan or bastard Veda Vyas penning the holiest Vedas and Mahabharat. How about the tales of the butcher who had acquiered a high state of being - just by practicing his trade uprightly.

  Hinduism also says about human body as a divine opportunity to achieve salvation -- I'm sure you must have heard this upteen times -if you ever attended any religious discourse or meeting -- of any group of Hindus.

  Buddhism does not add to Hinduism -- it only subtracts the negatives of the then existing society -- and later adds its own versions of Gods and incarnations. However, still Buddhism largely follows the principle tenets -- Hinduism has acquired an unholy hue in form of rigid caste system.

  Umesh

Rajen Barua <barua25 at hotmail.com> wrote:
      >It is utopian to think that all humans are equal -- thats what communism also says
  >It is practical to admit that each one should rise to do best what s/he can do in their lives.

  Yes, you are right Hinduism is a practical religion to go by to maintain the status quo.
  But the problem is we also have the following in Hinduism for which one cannot rise to do the best.

  >"Bhishma said:The status of a Brahmana is incapable of acquisition by a
>person belonging to any of the three other orders. That status is the
>highest with respect to all creatures.

  Hinduism highlighted the inequality in human being in so many words. When we couple that with 'karma' and 'duty', one's mind is set.
  Buddhism did not highlighted this difference. 

  When the US constitution says 'all men are equal' it does not mean all men have equal quality etc.  
  When Buddhism says "All men are born equal and all have equal potential to attain Budhahood  it does not mean all are equally qualified to be scholars or computer scientists. It just mean all have equal potential to be the perfect man and attain Buddhahood in his lifetime" 
  (You may still say: It is utopian to think that all humans are equal -- thats what communism also says)
  And with the same mode of thinking, Hinduism highlight this inequality. Not only that it gives a convincing reason and justification why men are not equal.
  Five fingers are never equal.
  Basically Hinduism looked at the differences and philosophized and perpetuated these differences with the mode of thinking that the glass is always half empty.
  Buddhism ignored the difference and focused on how to make the glass full.
  "All men have equal potential to attain Buddhahood in his own lifetime."
  Rajenda 

Umesh Sharma
5121 Lackawanna ST
College Park, MD 20740

 1-202-215-4328 [Cell Phone]

Ed.M. - International Education Policy
Harvard Graduate School of Education,
Harvard University,
Class of 2005

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