[Assam] Need of Uniform in Assam Assembly-Reply to Chitta
Jyotirmoy Sharma
jsharma at iinet.net.au
Fri Aug 24 15:43:11 PDT 2007
Hi Mr Mahanta
If I may sneak in....
The fear of the lungi menace as Chitta had mentioned before is a
combination of all - religion, language and culture. So
"Islamophoia" as you call it is also part of it. But let's see
whether this fear is justified or not.. A few examples from what
history taught us:-
a) Bangladesh won independence with India's help - even B'desh cannot
deny that. After independence who do you think their loyalty lies -
Pak or India? Why? Is religion not the deciding factor. Some years
back B'desh sent back some 16 mutilated BSF bodies as a gift to India
as a way of "Thank You". Think those BSF guys were involved in border
protection and somehow the B'deshis got hold of them. Our crippled
Govt(think great poet AB Vajpayee -excuse my spelling here was the
PM then) did not even have the guts to send an appropriate response.
b) Babri masjid(an unused mosque) was demolished by some Rs10/hr paid
goons of VHP-BJP combined. Well known fact and has been widely
covered in the media. What happened afterwards? Why did the press go
silent on the hundreds of temples destroyed across Pak/Bdesh. Hindus
were raped and killed in B'desh. Did media give much coverage to
that? When a B'deshi woman( Taslima Nasreen) tried to cover the
atrocities in her book "Lajja" - what happened? A fatwa was issued on
her head and she had to leave the country. So much for open speech,
respect for other people and their religion in those countries. Tell
me Mr Mahanta, what rights does Hindus have in B'desh? Do you want
these people as your neighbours? Why do we always have to bend our
backs to accommodate them? So when villages, towns, districts are
swarmed by these people... should people just look the other way as
if nothing happened.
There are countless examples that you will find if you care to see.
So Mr Mahanta, there is fear. Fear that the very values we have in
Assam will be destroyed when gradually the Assam landscape is merged
with the Bangladeshi one. When minorities become the majority and
start imposing their values, religion and way of life -there is a
reason for concern.
JS
On 25/08/2007, at 1:50 AM, Chan Mahanta wrote:
> Hi Chitta:
>
>
> >IMHO this problem can not be solved by government of India or by
> those whom you want to see in >power. Influx will continue till
> potential difference, osmotic pressure on both sides become equal.
> >All the attempts to solve the problem will just may be increase
> the resistance, but flow will not >cease till pressure equalisation
> occurs.
>
>
> *** Is this YOUR personal view, or is it the view of ALL who are
> outraged over the 'lungi menace' and are besides themselves, in
> Assamnet , in Assam and in the Hinduttwa circles in India?
>
> Regardless, IF that is the reality, then why the shrill, xenophobic
> rhetoric in various shades of camouflage all over? Is it HELPING in
> any way, other than POISONING the environment every which way?
>
> Knowing this reality, those who ceaselessly keep pointing at the
> lungi-menace specter, but doing or seeking nothing to help MANAGE
> the problem by taking steps that are realistic , achievable and
> humane, do it because of WHAT Chitta?
>
> I would submit, it is in big part, due to various degrees of
> Islamophobia. And since that upsets you, perhaps you will have a
> more persuasive and benign explanation?
>
>
>
>
>
>> Krishnendu said
>> ***“Thanks for rejecting the voting by Indian/Assamese population.
>> This really shows how much willing you are to accept the verdict
>> of people. You will surely reject the referendum on similar flimsy
>> ground that these people do not know what they are doing. And
>> before you jump on debate and discussion, if there is a really
>> free platform to debate (without threats from some sections),
>> there will be many more voice rejecting the Sovereignty issue. As
>> you have noticed, the Assamese intellegsia has already rejected
>> Sovereign Assam theory (if you think otherwise, tell me 10
>> prominent people of Assam who support it); you have already
>> rejected the voting by common people of Assam ..... So who remains
>> to support you on your referendum?
>>
>>
> Mahanta da , your response to Krishnendu’s above observation will
> be appreciated. We can see that Krishnedu’s logical Brahmstras are
> proving to be too much for you. So just one more small query on
> what he said. I think this was also missed by you and response will
> clear the doubts of many people.
>
>
> *** Heh-heh! That is about as absurd a set of questions as one can
> imagine. But since you guys thought that is your ACE , your trump
> card, here we are:
>
> >Thanks for rejecting the voting by Indian/Assamese
> population.
>
> ***You explained below:
>
>
> I did not know that you woulld be so removed from
> demographic reality of Assam. Do you
> or I have any clue of that 65% who voted what % will be
> those who are considered as
> threat or what % feels threatened? For every one's benefit
> lingustic break up of 2001
> census is also kept secret. So 100% of turn out in Assam
> election also does not mean
> you can have a government which will reflect the aspiration
> of origianl inhabitants o
> the state.
>
>
> *** Is this the democracy you are so devoted to? And WHO exactly
> is this govt. elected by therefore? B'deshis? And if so what are
> you guys doing about it?
>
>
> Can't you see the appalling contradictions in yours or K's
> statements, assertions and questions?
>
>
> So, do YOU accept the election result as a democratic verdict,
> given by an informed polity, considering the issues ?
>
> If it is not, like you all spare no words to present it as on the
> one hand and on the other hand accuse me not only of being
> undemocratic for pointing it out, but also insinuate my promoting
> an autocratic regime for Assam?
>
> Is it even nominally an intellectually honest argument?
>
>
>
> >If tomorrow Assam gets that elusive independence, how do you plan
> to run the Govt (i.e. if you plan to >migrate back to Assam to help
> build it)
>
> **** My first option will be to try the STEPS you all are
> advocating to change Assam to a truly democratic state.
>
> But since there is nothing there, zero, zit, nada, gwlla---I will
> propose what I delineated in the final chapter of Why Independence
> posts right here in assamnet a few months back.
>
> Democratic values do not fall from the sky, nor are they produced
> by an innate condition, imprinted on desi-genes. It has to be
> inculcated, taught. It would not happen 'overnight' , fairy-tale
> like. But in a decade or two it will change dramatically, unlike
> the past six decades in which desi-demokrasy has remained;
> dysfunctional, mired in slogans and make-beliefs, waved only to
> seek the blessings of those it so craves, but does not give a damn
> in reality.
>
>
>
> >And before you jump on debate and discussion, if there is a really
> free platform to debate (without >threats from some sections),
>
>
> **** That is a self-fulfilling prophecy. Since no forum exists for
> a free and unfettered discussion , thanks to its intelligentsia's
> democratic values, why talk about a referendum?
>
> Well how about RAISING your voices to change that? Is it a
> possibility? Surely you spare no words to bring the lungi-menace to
> the forefront, do you?
>
>
>
> > If tomorrow Assam gets that elusive independence, how do you plan
> to run the Govt (i.e. if you plan to >migrate back to Assam to help
> build it) with the entire population favoring Desi Demokrasy ? One
> >option might be to go for a ethnic cleansing and import hoards of
> Bangladeshis to run it.
>
>
> **** Again the first impulse will be to depend on desi-demokrasy's
> finest, its bureaucracy, its laws and its institutions of
> democracy. But since Assam is where it is, BECAUSE of it, we will
> have to change things. Won't happen overnight. But it is doable.
> Many others have done that in the past.
>
> But it takes an ability to IMAGINE things. An absence of
> imagination is what gives rise to questions like the above. Try it
> a sometimes. You mighrt actually get hooked.
>
> m-da :-)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> At 9:33 AM -0700 8/18/07, chittaranjan pathak wrote:
>> Mahanta da
>> Please find my responses to your observation
>>
>> CM*** That is your explanation. OK, fair enough. Let me ask you
>> this: What is your reaction to garish alien culture temples pock-
>> marking the once beautiful Assamese landscape, including smack-dab
>> in the middle of Kaziranga ? When was the last time you can point
>> to anyone complaing about that?
>>
>> Mahanta da I dont blame you. Guwahati, halt at wild grass and then
>> to upper Assam. That must be your usual route in Assam. Go to
>> lower Assam-Dhubri, Kokrajhar, Barpeta-you will start wondering
>> whether landscape belongs to Assam , Bengal or Bangladesh.
>>
>> CM***Or for that matter full 25 % of Karbi Anglong population is
>> Hindi speaking, about to get its own autonomous defense
>> establishment? Or of Tinsukia ?
>>
>> By automous defence establishment -do you mean police districts?
>> When compared to area of other Assam districts, KA may be can have
>> some 10 police districts. In fact Assam governemnt was for long
>> thinking about declaring the separate landmass of Hamren as
>> separate district. But 6th schedule and Karbi politics was
>> blocking this. So this new move does not have anything to do with
>> the Hindi speaking people.
>> And on this 25% population-Assamese do not go to do those manial
>> jobs in KA or NC Hills. So body will have to work in the field of
>> Karbi farmers-is not it? Compare their (the Biharis of KA)
>> population (some 50,000) and political clout with people of
>> suspected foreign nationality. And these people are still known as
>> Desuwali because under very adverse situation they still go back
>> to their Chaapra, Darbhanga, Munger, Bhagalpur etc.So I did not
>> get it what was so great about 25% figure-that to in a district
>> which is one of the most sparsely populated.
>> ***Now then a huge problem facing the 'Oxomiya' identity not to
>> mention 'national-security' and complete destruction of the rule
>> of law ( as aptly pointed out by Ram) has been brewing and
>> building for over a quarter century -- the lungi menace. A select
>> group of Oxomiyas ( I won't attempt to label it, but I could :-))
>> and a certain segment of the English language press have been
>> wailing about it, charging ULFA with carrying out ISI orders to
>> gift wrap Assam over to Islamists from the east, and to be fair,
>> when challenged, at least nominally admitting GOVERNMENTS'
>> responsibilities over the issue: Upholding the laws of the land.
>>
>> Well well Mahanta da-this Bangladeshi nationals issue and some
>> Assamese crying foul over it-are you trying to avoid dubbing it as
>> a problem or threat just because your ULFA is blamed by some
>> people for encouraging the influx? If instead of ULFA , BSF or
>> government would have been blamed, then may be you would have
>> accepted it as a problem haunting Assamese nationality. And may be
>> you might have used it as a prime reason for wanting to be
>> independent. We salute your blind faith-no more on this issue.
>>
>> ***For over twenty five years this dereliction of
>> governmental duties ( as pointed out by Ram, the Sentinel, Dilli
>> based security analysts etc.) for failing to stem the flow of the
>> lungi-menace has been going on, unabated. Do the governments care?
>> What are the governmental duties? Whose duty is what? What have
>> they been doing? Would it be reasonable to say almost NOTHING? If
>> so, don't the voters who vote so intelligently ( as I was
>> corrected by outraged netters for my temerity to question that
>> recently ) CARE about this abject dereliction of governmental duties?
>> Would it be reasonable for us to conclude THEY DON'T, as soundly
>> affirmed by the re-election of the Assam government by a huge 65%
>> voter turnout?
>>
>> I did not know that you woulld be so removed from demographic
>> reality of Assam. Do you or I have any clue of that 65% who voted
>> what % will be those who are considered as threat or what % feels
>> threatened? For every one's benefit lingustic break up of 2001
>> census is also kept secret. So 100% of turn out in Assam election
>> also does not mean you can have a government which will reflect
>> the aspiration of origianl inhabitants of the state.
>>
>> ***So Chitta, tell me why anyone should BELIEVE that your
>> outrage over the 'lungi-menace' or Ram's or of the others like
>> you, is over ILLEGALITY of the immigrants?
>>
>> Again I am at loss. Elected government has failed to check the
>> influx. Does that mean people should remain silent just because
>> government is elected by them knowing fully well that Assam's
>> demography is not like Orissa or Bengal to give a government which
>> will be more reflective of one single majority community's
>> aspiration. Governemnt is constrained by some of its own
>> components because of the process of democracy in a
>> demographically heterogeneous Assam and this constrain will remain
>> even if Assam is separated from India.
>>
>> ***That leaves the Islamophobia , as the pre-eminent reason, as
>> is evidenced by a pervasive and ancient animus. Oh I know that
>> most know how to package it in genteel and secular wraps. And it
>> is not as virulent as say Togadia's, or the RSS' or VHP's or
>> displaced Sileti Hindus' . I point here to the RSS' Jagadamba
>> Mall's article in its mouthpiece the Organizer, quoted in Sanjib
>> Baruah's Post Frontier Blues as an example.
>>
>> Oh really!! I knew this where you were coming at. Forget Togodia
>> and come back to your Xonor Oxom. So you believe Assamese people
>> become paranoid because of the religion issue only? Where was the
>> religion and islamic component when hundreds of people have been
>> killed in Karbi-Kuki, Bodo-Adivasi conflicts? Tell me in your
>> pristine northeast in the conflicts between Naga-Asomiya, Khasi-
>> Garo, Karbi-Dimasa where people are killed just because they do
>> not speak, dress, eat alike-where is the islamic anagle? Were you
>> trying to say that Togodias communal politics have taught Assamese
>> people to be xenophobic and otherwise there was no issue with
>> xenophobia in Assam and NE?
>>
>> ***But even in its benign wrappings, the outcry, replete with
>> claims of a grand conspiracy to hand Assam over to B'desh, over
>> their own 'democratically elected' government conspiring to
>> certify illegals as genuine, of ULFA as an ISI agent doing its
>> bidding to help overrun Assam with the lungi-menace, of posing
>> shrill questions like 'how is it that Arunachal or Nagaland can
>> throw them out but we can't' ; the message is very clear to all
>> those who are not inferentially challenged.
>> Who are we kidding?
>>
>> What is the message Mahanta da?
>>
>> ***I am not suggesting the outrage is not justifiable. There is
>> some justification to it--as far as governmental dysfunction is.
>> But where is Assam's intelligentsia or for that matter India's,
>> to act to help change the unresponsive and dysfunctional system?
>> When have you seen an editor-for-hire write an editorial on HOW to
>> change the dysfunctional government.
>>
>> Were we discussing the duty of press or government or you were
>> supposed to tell us why you dub Assamese people's anti-BDeshi
>> tirade as anti muslim? We all know, you do not have the answer.
>>
>>
>> ****Last but not the least is the absence of a remotely informed
>> and intelligent discourse on HOW can the B'deshi problem , both
>> real and imagined , be resolved, if at all?
>>
>> IMHO this problem can not be solved by government of India or by
>> those whom you want to see in power. Influx will continue till
>> potential difference, osmotic pressure on both sides become equal.
>> All the attempts to solve the problem will just may be increase
>> the resistance, but flow will not cease till pressure equalisation
>> occurs.
>>
>> ***Can YOU explain why it is missing ? I have some ideas. But I
>> know it will distract everyone from the subject as it always does,
>> when I share my views :-). Want to give it a try?
>>
>> By all means-lets give it a try. Please share your views.
>>
>> Also Mahanta da you seem to have missed some vital questions asked
>> by Krishnendu. It will be so nice if you try to throw some light
>> on those also.
>>
>> Krishnendu said
>> ***“Thanks for rejecting the voting by Indian/Assamese population.
>> This really shows how much willing you are to accept the verdict
>> of people. You will surely reject the referendum on similar flimsy
>> ground that these people do not know what they are doing. And
>> before you jump on debate and discussion, if there is a really
>> free platform to debate (without threats from some sections),
>> there will be many more voice rejecting the Sovereignty issue. As
>> you have noticed, the Assamese intellegsia has already rejected
>> Sovereign Assam theory (if you think otherwise, tell me 10
>> prominent people of Assam who support it); you have already
>> rejected the voting by common people of Assam ..... So who remains
>> to support you on your referendum?
>>
>>
>> Mahanta da , your response to Krishnendu’s above observation will
>> be appreciated. We can see that Krishnedu’s logical Brahmstras are
>> proving to be too much for you. So just one more small query on
>> what he said. I think this was also missed by you and response
>> will clear the doubts of many people.
>>
>> ***Krishnendu said
>> “ Over past few years we have learnt that School Teachers of
>> Assam, Villagers of Assam (who lynched ULFA), Bureaucrats of
>> Assam, Assam Police, AXX and now even Assam Press ----- all of
>> them favor Desi Demokrasy over Independent Assam ..... enemies of
>> Assam. If tomorrow Assam gets that elusive independence, how do
>> you plan to run the Govt (i.e. if you plan to migrate back to
>> Assam to help build it) with the entire population favoring Desi
>> Demokrasy ? One option might be to go for a ethnic cleansing and
>> import hoards of Bangladeshis to run it. Not sure if that is the
>> plan :)”
>>
>>
>> If I can reframe his question-in the new scheme of things you wish
>> for, how will you change the mindset of the population. Can you
>> cite the example of a role model who has capacity to inspire the
>> entire disaffected lot? One who will not be affected by money, one
>> who will not go Prafulla-Bharat Narah way, one who will not resort
>> to all too familiar plunder to make for the time lost in jungle?
>> Give it a try if you can. If you had the answers , may be you
>> could have said in few lines. But to hide that lack of answer, you
>> will have to write a tretise to distract, confuse us. So if it
>> takes please feel free to skip the questions. We understand
>> Mahanta da!!
>> Regards
>> Chittaranjan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> m-da
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> At 6:21 AM -0700 8/14/07, chittaranjan pathak wrote:
>>> Well, yes Mahanta da, I am still at loss.
>> Please explain to me and to others like Ramda, more explicitly why
>> you try to make the Assamese Hindus suffer from collective guilt
>> complex by dubbing their anti BDesh stance as an anti Muslim one.
>> Decrying others of being unnecessarily sensitive to lungi menace
>> and yourself garbing a selectively broadminded image-this is quite
>> beguiling!! Or is there a hidden motive and may be you also have
>> the same level of jingoism you accuse your fellow Assamese Hindus
>> of harbouring, which for the time being may be you have kept in
>> suspended animation for some technical reasons.
>>
>> By the way, a clarification on why I used the term Assamese Hindus
>> (at which you jumped to emphasize that the usage of that term
>> itself exposed every thing-I don’t know what you meant)
>> 1) I believe amongst the Assamese speakers-they (Hindus) are still
>> in majority in Assam. Or do you think otherwise?
>> 2) They are the more vocal on this issue infiltration by BDeshis
>> 3) This feeling of paranoia is present amongst Assamese speaking
>> Muslim also. But their protestations are not that loud as their
>> Hindu counterparts as they are less in number, many come from more
>> disadvantaged back ground. Many of those who are economically well
>> off, educated, learned and city bred (say from Lakhtokiya of
>> Guwahati), same religious affiliations and post 9/11 more cohesive
>> feeling make it some what difficult for them to be as vocal as
>> their Hindu counterparts. Most of the educated Assamese Hindus
>> understand this dilemma and should not have qualms about it.
>> So I hope it is now clear why I used the term Assamese Hindus?
>> CM said
>> *****Are only 'Assamese Hindus' burdened by illegal immigrants? Is
>> Assam the home of B'deshi despising Hindus only? And if they are
>> the only ones outraged or aggrieved, then is it ALL of Assam's
>> Hindus or most or just a handful of them? And is it because of:
>> The offenders' name?
>> The color of their skin?
>> Their cuisine?
>> The language they speak?
>> The lungis they wear and the skull-caps they flaunt?
>> The unkind cuts the male of their species live with?
>> The high wage jobs they deprive the natives of?
>> The economy they depress by their dependence on public charity?
>> The criminal activities they spread in society?
>> The corruption they promote by bribery of public officials?
>> The economic progress they thwart by their habitual sloth?
>> Inundate the free public health-care system?
>> Flood the public school system with children of the non-producing,
>> lowering the quality of education?
>> Usurp and rob the Oxomiya bhaxa of its purity and ownership?
>> Other ills I have not mentioned, deliberately or otherwise?
>> Or is it because of their religious persuasion?*****
>>
>> Your numerous clues did not help me much. If the last line was
>> your punch line it is again the same hackneyed manifestation of
>> your covert agenda. As I told you many times before-it is not the
>> religion alone. It is the religion combined with language combined
>> with an alien culture that has been causing the discomfort. If
>> there are millions of khukri wielding Saulor phut luwa Daajus and
>> Kaanchas also, the reaction of the local populace would have been
>> similar.
>> So I am still at dark about your attempts. Please explain more
>> explicitly and clearly unlike those numerous inconclusive mails
>> where you end by saying something like “I will explain later if
>> you want” or by adopting those avoiding techniques saying that “I
>> will explain if you first answer this question”.
>> Come on Mahanta da enlighten us on the eve of 60th Independence
>> Day of India.
>> Regards
>> Chittaranjan Pathak
>>
>> Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge to see
>> what's on, when.
>> *** That is your explanation. OK, fair enough. Let me ask you
>> this: What is your reaction to garish alien culture temples pock-
>> marking the once beautiful Assamese landscape, including smack-dab
>> in the middle of Kaziranga ? When was the last time you can point
>> to anyone complaing about that?
>>
>>
>>
>> Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha!
>> Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at
>> Yahoo! Games.
>
> _______________________________________________
> assam mailing list
> assam at assamnet.org
> http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.assamnet.org/pipermail/assam-assamnet.org/attachments/20070825/0d9a9aa2/attachment.htm>
More information about the Assam
mailing list