[Air-L] Elsevier is taking down papers from Academia.edu

Sat Dec 7 16:19:50 PST 2013

Darren—I don’t disagree at all.  I think my point (perhaps badly made) is
that most scholarly associations and many universities might not be able or
willing to do that.  John

From: profpurcell at gmail.com [mailto:profpurcell at gmail.com] On Behalf Of
Darren Purcell
Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 6:17 PM
To: John McNutt
Cc: air-l at listserv.aoir.org
Subject: Re: [Air-L] Elsevier is taking down papers from Academia.edu

John, they do a great deal of work to make publications occur.  I grant you
that, but they are not paying for the vast majority of labor they rely upon.
If I review a paper, it is 3-4 hours of reading, checking ideas, etc. If we
assume we all only receive papers that are in the center of our active
research programs, narrow that down to 1-2 hours for a thoughtful, useful
review.  Even that low number yields some potentially expensive reviews for
many comm/ICT journals that publish 80-100 articles annually if publishers
were paying for the actually work product. 

I for one would like to have 1/2 my hourly consulting rate for the reviews I
did last year. Homero probably would as well. 

Darren

--------------------------------------------------------
Darren Purcell

Associate Professor and Undergraduate Adviser
Dept. of Geography and Environmental Sustainability
University of Oklahoma

Email: dpurcell at ou.edu
Skype: profpurcell
(405) 325-9193
http://ou.academia.edu/DarrenPurcell

On Sat, Dec 7, 2013 at 5:02 PM, John McNutt <mcnuttjg at netzero.com> wrote:

I agree but there is a lot of expensive stuff here.  Even if you take the
physical distribution out of the mix, publishers do a lot of things to get
it out the door, keep it indexed and marketed and so forth.   Some
associations (many of which are small) use publishers to meet a lot of their
back office needs as well.

-----Original Message-----
From: air-l-bounces at listserv.aoir.org
[mailto:air-l-bounces at listserv.aoir.org] On Behalf Of Nathaniel Poor
Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 4:59 PM
To: Gil De Zuniga, Homero
Cc: air-l at listserv.aoir.org
Subject: Re: [Air-L] Elsevier is taking down papers from Academia.edu

It seems like double billing.

Your U paid you to do the research. Your U pays the publisher to allow
access for those at your U to that research.

That is simplified, but not inaccurate.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 7, 2013, at 2:46 PM, "Gil De Zuniga, Homero"
<hgz at austin.utexas.edu> wrote:
>
> I know this might sound a bit odd, and I admit it beforehand : -} But
> it sends to me that "us" researchers are the ones who are really losing in
this trend, beyond the discussion of open research.
> 1. We do the research
> 2. We review the research
> 3. The research gets published by Elsevier and other publishers, or
> Academia.edu 4. We make no money.
> 5. They do.
> I agree the system should be open. But if it's not, why shouldn't be the
case that at least a decent part of the financial benefits revert back to
the authors, departments, research units, schools, etc...
> Saludos,
> HGZ
>
> Homero Gil de Zúñiga
> Associate Professor
> Director, Digital Media Research Program (DMRP)
> communication.utexas.edu/strauss/dmrp
> Annette Strauss Institute for Civic Life College of Communication
> University of Texas - Austin utexas.edu Voice (512) 471 6323
<tel:%28512%29%20471%206323>  Fax (512)
> 471 7979 www.homerogdz.com Google Scholar Profile @_HGZ_
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: "Robert W. Gehl"
> Date:12/07/2013 11:08 (GMT-06:00)
> To: air-l at listserv.aoir.org
> Subject: Re: [Air-L] Elsevier is taking down papers from Academia.edu
>
> Setting aside individual publishers' rules about posting pre-prints to
> a /personal/ site, I've wondered for some time why publishers have not
> yet gone after Academia.edu, which is not a personal site, but a
> centralized social network built in part on top of a lot of copyright
violations.
> It's YouTube all over again.
>
> - Rob
>
> Robert W. Gehl
> Assistant Professor, Department of Communication Affiliated Faculty,
> University Writing Program The University of Utah
> www.robertwgehl.org<http://www.robertwgehl.org> | @robertwgehl Sent
> from our OS on our Internet
>
> Watch for my book, Reverse Engineering Social Media, from Temple in
> 2014
>
>> On 12/07/2013 08:28 AM, Jen Jack Gieseking wrote:
>> To determine exactly what versions of papers you are allowed to post
>> publicly per contracts, you can use the Sherpa Romeo database to
>> search copyright policies of most journals in a clear, easy to understand
format:
>> http://www.sherpa.ac.uk/romeo/.
>> JJG
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jen Jack Gieseking, Ph.D.
>> Postdoctoral Fellow in New Media and Data Visualization Digital and
>> Computational Studies Initiative, Bowdoin College
>> jgieseking at gmail.com www.jgieseking.org<http://www.jgieseking.org>
>> www.spatiallyinclined.org<http://www.spatiallyinclined.org>
>> @jgieseking <https://twitter.com/jgieseking>
>>
>>
>>> On Sat, Dec 7, 2013 at 10:07 AM, Michael Zimmer <zimmerm at uwm.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>> Precisely.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Michael Zimmer, PhD
>>> Assistant Professor, School of Information Studies Director, Center
>>> for Information Policy Research University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee
>>> e: zimmerm at uwm.edu
>>> w: www.michaelzimmer.org<http://www.michaelzimmer.org>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Dec 7, 2013, at 6:21 AM, Joseph Reagle <joseph.2011 at reagle.org>
wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 12/06/2013 10:41 PM, Michael Zimmer wrote:
>>>>> Whoever wrote this isn't very familiar with publisher copyright
>>>>> transfer agreements.
>>>> Some publishers often distinguish between the author's draft and
>>>> the final peer reviewed and paginated version. That is, posting a
>>>> draft on your site (or to SSRN, say) is permissible, copying the
>>>> final version is not. Hence I'm curious as to which these removed
versions were?
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