[Assam] Math First: Harvard & UVa study on college science success

Sun Jul 29 11:14:24 PDT 2007

C-da,

Glad to hear that you had a great time this weekend. I am sure your tough life at IIT as a budding architect made you doubly tenacious.

Best.

Umesh

Ram Sarangapani <assamrs at gmail.com> wrote: Hi C'da,

 I am glad you all had a great weekend. I am trying to send you a nice response - but it will take some time and serious thinking :)

 Till then

 --Ram

 On 7/29/07, Chan Mahanta <cmahanta at charter.net> wrote:   O' Ram:

 Hope your weekend is going well. We had a nice kharkhowa gathering, along with some  kolgutikhowas and even a couple of desuali  folks last evening. This has been the most pleasant of July weather I can recall in our 32 years in St. Louis. A light breeze carrying mist from the river kept us comfortable, the mosquitos were on vacation, the cicadas were noisy but our friends' conversation kept them at bay and my mango-margarita kept everyone mellower than the near full-moon's light under a clear sky, until we fared our friends well- in whose honor we hosted the gathering--on their impending 
 trip to the desert of Rajasthan where he will be teaching business management as a Fullbright Scholar
 on sabbatical at Pilani and she will be there to keep him company.

 Anyway,  I read your thoughts here. As usual, no problems with your being a non-engineer. I am not one either. In IIT we, the architecture students, were laughed at by our engineering friends, because we did not use slide-rules, which was equivalent to looking down upon people who count with their fingertips, the lowest of the low-tech lot, a few notches below the logarithmatic-table users. We tried to turn the tables by laughing at their drawing skills. But they knew how to put us even further down: They told us that they will always have draftsmen ( I don't remember hearing of draftswomen) to do their dirty work, while we shall remain pencil-pushers for ever. That was really below the below the belt, and it hurt. 

 Enough about my sad stories.

 On the fools'-rush front, I won't hold anyone guilty of crimes that I routinely commit. So rest easy there also.

 By now if you are beginning to fret about   all the nicey-nice leader to this response and wondering if I am about spring a tripper on you, relax there too. I don't have anything tricky up my sleeve this morning. 

 All I ask is WHAT exactly were you and your cheering section, ably led by Krishendu,  trying to prove or disprove ? Once I get a bearing on that, I will be pleased to share my thoughts.

 Take care.

 c-da

 At 9:16 AM -0600 7/28/07, Ram Sarangapani wrote:
 C'da   Being a non-engineer, and susori-musori pass kora individual, I may not be qualified to comment in this high-flying math/engg. debate - but nevertheless, I will try... you know, "fools rush in where angels...."    One, is it is generally recognized that Indian graduating from Indian schools are good in math/science. Not because they boast about it, but because they just are. There are extremely bright people there.  Most of the people who have been a big success in this and other countries have had their "fundas" from India, and most Assamese from the Engg. colleges in Assam, and education in cotton or GU or DU.    Second, you charge that because you don't see contributions from these people in India, then obviously these graduates are Not creative etc.   It is possible that even though these Indians may be creative and intelligent, but may NOT be willing or are not able to contribute to societies they came from. Maybe, they came to the USA to make more money (read
 better opportunities). While, I do not think there is anything wrong with that, let us realize that  there are many many people in India who are just as capabale or better than immigrants to the US and who have contributed to Indian's growth and development.    Third, if these people were not creative in India, how is it that these very same people with the basic fundamentals from India have suddenly become creative here? Did they suddenly sprout wings?    Lastly, (and I may the loner here) - Math & science are great, but let us not put down other branches. There are many world leaders (Kennedy/Gandhi/Nehru etc) who have come from non-science, non-tech backgrounds, but have been instrumental in development and broad visions for their countrues.    If it wasn't for Nehru, many today would NOT have gone to the IITs. Yes, those same IITs that have enabled many to build careers in the US and in India. Yes, those same IITs that have built the very foundations that they so
 easily rubbish today.    If it wasn't for JFK, man may not have gone to the moon. A country needs visionaries, just like it needs bright people from every other branch.   More later
  --Ram   On 7/28/07, Chan Mahanta <cmahanta at charter.net> wrote:
 >By this logic, with so many successful Indian
Engineers and Scientists in US and other countries the
primary math foundation laid by Indian School system
must be excellent.

*** Can you cite some statistics, or even educated guesses on how " 
many successful Indian
Engineers and Scientists in US and other countries" are there, and
what percentage is that of :

A: Total number of scientists and engineers produced by India?

B: Total number of people of the demographics of which these are a 
segment and how the rest are doing ?

C: HOW these "successful" products of an 'excellent' Indian education
system have contributed to India's well being?

D: How the rest of the 'excellent' Indian education system have 
contributed to India's well being?

At 6:36 AM -0700 7/28/07, Krishnendu Chakraborty wrote:
>  >>Can you cite India's contributions to it?
>
>
>Yes ---- Chandan Mahanta :) 
>
>
>>>>>   If your primary math
>foundation is weak, you will never get to do intensive
>math at high
>school, forget science and engineering.
>
>By this logic, with so many successful Indian 
>Engineers and Scientists in US and other countries the
>primary math foundation laid by Indian School system
>must be excellent.
>
>
>
>
>
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Umesh Sharma

Washington D.C. 

1-202-215-4328 [Cell]

Ed.M. - International Education Policy
Harvard Graduate School of Education,
Harvard University,
Class of 2005

http://www.uknow.gse.harvard.edu/index.html (Edu info)

http://hbswk.hbs.edu/ (Management Info)

www.gse.harvard.edu/iep  (where the above 2 are used )

http://jaipurschool.bihu.in/

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