[Assam] force is effective only as a preventative

Tue Jun 8 06:35:23 PDT 2010

Dear Sushanta,

I'm in a bit of hurry, but just want to set one thing right. Will respond in
detail later.

You wrote:

>"You heart is crying for Jews, and is feeling happy seeing the sufferings
of Palestine.And still you are a great free thinker.No one can blame >that
you have any bias .Only because you are with US and Brits!:)

It is really sad, that this is what you took from what I wrote. How do you
know how I feel? I try to understand the plight of both Jews and
Palestinians. The solutions in the region are not easy, and I will NOT
pretend I have solutions. It was you who kept calling the Jews Zionists, the
US imperialists, and the bloody Brits.

That Palestinians or Jews get killed is sad - only very stupid people feel
"happy" when someone gets killed. When looking at such issues, I, like most
people try to be fair (may not seem so to you).

After 9/11, when 3000 people got killed, the world saw TV footage from many
parts of the Middle East jumping up and down with joy, and shooting guns in
the air. I'll leave that with you to ponder for the moment.

--Ram da

On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 10:40 AM, Sushanta Kar <pragyan.tsc50 at gmail.com>wrote:

> Dear
> Ramda,
> I'm sorry again for late response. It's very interesting and politically
> live topic. I could have participate seriously, had I enough time for that.
> Sitting in front of computer I also can cite hundred of example and links
> in
> favor of my statements.
> But, what use of it , you will always say them biased report and researched
> .
> I can only quarrel with you can't make you agree. And as I've learned in
> this US lead world that everything pro US is free Thinking here, and
> anything against is biased . Any thing pro US is struggle for democracy,
> anything against it is terrorism. Anything in favour of Israel is question
> of security, anything against it is threat to that unjust Nation.
>
> You heart is crying for Jews, and is feeling happy seeing the sufferings of
> Palestine.And still you are a great free thinker.No one can blame that you
> have any bias .Only because you are with US and Brits!:)
> Don't mind please, to  be frank  enough, you are distorting the small piece
> of information those  I'm presenting here. I'm afraid what   what will
> happen if I write big enough.
> See you have written *"he problem is .. nor can the Arabs. They too don't
> have an absolute claim.
> The whole area was ruled by the Brits. The Arabs too base their claim on
> mythology. Abraham, had a child, Ishmail through his servant, and that is
> the Arab claim - also based on mythology, Old Testament and Bibilical
> narratives.
>
> In any case, for many centuries, both Jewish and Arabs lived peacefully
> side-by-side. In fact, even the Koran cites examples where the Arabs often
> had Jews to support them in fighting enemies."*
>
> BUT You didn't talked about this part of my statement,"Israel is such a
> country. Jew, i*rrespective of their languages and culture*, came from
> whole
> world to create Israel out of Palestine."
> All know ( including I and You) that Zionism is a religion originated in
> Israel . But, what I'm saying is that all the Jews are not of  Israel
> origin.Like all the Muslims of the world are not Arab origin. You are
> talking about Arab's mythological believes, But don't mind, you are silent
> on 'migration' issue. If all the Jews of the world can  claim Israel their
> legitimate country, to go with your logic I can rather raise demand that
> all
> the Muslims  of this world should go to the Israel and make their country
> or
> all the Buddhist of the world should come to India--the land where their
> religion originated. ( I'm afraid, What will happen to Bangladeshi issue
> then?) Let all the Chinese come to India and make their homeland, Hows the
> Idea!
> See what* the other page of your link says o*n migration:
> "The *Zionist <http://www.mideastweb.org/zionism.htm>* movement arose to
> restore the Jews to Israel, largely ignoring the existing Arab population.
> Following the Balfour Declaration
> <http://www.mideastweb.org/mebalfour.htm>in 1917, Palestine was
> granted to Britain as a League
> of Nations mandate <http://mideastweb.org/Mandate.htm> to build a national
> home for the Jewish people. The Arabs resented the Jews coming in to take
> their land. Led by Grand Mufti Hajj Amin El
> Husseini<http://www.zionism-israel.com/dic/Haj_Amin_El_Husseini.htm>,
> they rioted repeatedly and later revolted, creating a history of enmity
> between Jews and Arabs in Palestine. Britain stopped Jewish immigration to
> Palestine."
>  ( http://mideastweb.org/nutshell.htm)
> That's proof enough that Israel was not a construction of a democratic
> process.  and so is not a legitimate state!
> that's all!
>
> Sushanta
>
>
> On 7 June 2010 11:14, uttam borthakur <uttamborthakur at yahoo.co.in> wrote:
>
> >
> >                          We surely do not live in, or off, the US.
> >
> > But the Jewish Professor, who utters the following words, and quotes
> > Winston Churchill, surely does. So, he ought not (normative) have the
> > "victim mentality” (same use of adjectives such as 'bloody' Brits instead
> of
> > 'snooty' Brits or the ‘smug’ Americans!).
> >
> > XXXXXXX
> >
> > "Literal censorship barely exists in the United States, but thought
> control
> > is a flourishing industry, indeed an indispensable one in a free society
> > based on the principle of elite decision, public endorsement or
> passivity"
> >
> >
> > Xxxxxx
> >
> > “ The central device of the system of “brainwashing under freedom,”
> > developed in a most impressive fashion in the country that is perhaps the
> > most free, is to encourage debate over policy issues but within a
> framework
> > of presuppositions that incorporate the basic doctrines of the party
> line.
> > The more vigorous the debate the more effectively the presuppositions are
> > instilled, while participants and onlookers are overcome with awe and
> > self-adulation for their courage. Thus in the case of the Vietnam War,
> the
> > ideological institutions permitted a debate between the ‘hawks’ and
> “doves”;
> > in fact, the debate was not only permitted, but even encouraged by 1968,
> > when substantial sectors of American business had turned against the war
> as
> > too costly and harmful to their interest.”
> >
> > xxxxxx
> > "Mark Heller, deputy director of Jaffee Centre for Strategic Studies at
> Tel
> > Aviv University explains that 'state-sponsored terrorism is low intensity
> > warfare, and its victims, including the United States, are therefore
> > entitled to fight back with every means at their disposal.' It follows,
> > then, that other victims of "low intensity warfare" and "state sponsored
> > terrorism" are "entitled to fight back with every means at their
> disposal":
> > Salvadorans, Nicaraguans, Palestinians, Lebanese, and innumerable other
> > victims...... through out a good part of the world......... It is true
> that
> > these consequences follow only if we accept an elementary moral
> principle:
> > that we apply to ourselves the same standards we apply to others.......
> But
> > that principle, and what follows from adopting it, is scarcely
> > comprehensible in the prevailing intellectual culture, and would be
> hardly
> > be expressible in journals that demand stern punishment of others for
> their
> > crimes. In
> >  fact, were anyone to draw the logical consequence of these dicta and
> > express them clearly, they might well be subject to prosecution for
> inciting
> > terrorist violence against political leaders of the United States and its
> > allies"
> >
> >
> >
> > xxxxxx
> >  Per Winston Churchill: " ... we are not a young people with an innocent
> > record and a scanty inheritance. We have engrossed to ourselves... an
> > altogether disproportionate share of wealth and traffic of the world. We
> > have got all we want in territory, and our claim to be left in the
> > unmolested enjoyment of vast and splendid possessions, mainly acquired by
> > violence, largely maintained by force, often seems less reasonable to
> others
> > than to us.........
> >
> > ...." the government of the world must be entrusted to satisfied nations,
> > who wished nothing more for themselves than what they had. If the
> > world-government were in the hands of hungry nations, there would always
> be
> > danger. But none of us had any reason to seek anything more. The peace
> would
> > be kept by peoples who lived their own way and were not ambitious. Our
> power
> > placed us above the rest. We were like rich men dwelling at peace within
> > their habitation"
> >
> > From me: AMEN. I can only try to understand the limitations of the
> > ‘intellectual culture’, because I try to follow the humanist maxim that
> > nothing human is alien to me J
> > Uttam Kumar Borthakur
> >
> >
> >
>  ................................................................................................
> >  Ram Sarangapani assamrs at gmail.com
> > Sat Jun 5 06:32:33 IST 2010
> > >**** Sushanta's view is slanted ? I'll be danged ! Coming from an
> > upstanding and righteous one like you Ram,
> > >the likes of me must be standing on our heads :-) .
> >
> > And, C'da do you also have your own version? Would like to hear that too.
> > Sushanta's history is full of "bloody" Brits, imperialist this terrorist
> > Israel........ all the fault of the Brits, Israel, USA, and everyone
> else,
> > except the poor Palestinians, the Arabs.
> >
> > He starts off with a huge bias, and views the West basically as
> > imperialists
> > and of imposing their will on poorer countries.
> > Jeez, this "victim" mentality seems to be spreading like wild fire :-)
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > assam at assamnet.org
> > http://assamnet.org/mailman/listinfo/assam_assamnet.org
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Sushnta Kar
> সুশান্ত কর
> তিনসুকিয়া, আসাম
>
> আমার ব্লগগুলি:
> http://sushantakar40.blogspot.com
> http://ishankonerkahini.blogspot.com
> http://ishankonerkotha.blogspot.com
> আমার সম্পাদিত 'প্রজ্ঞান'
> http://pragyan06now.blogspot.com
> http://sites.google.com/site/pragyan06now
>
> "স্বাজাত্যের অহমিকার থেকে মুক্তি দানের শিক্ষাই, আজকের দিনের প্রধান শিক্ষা"
> রবীন্দ্রনাথ
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